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:: Posted by SnakeCained on November 17, 2014

Ah there are some classic Crimson tricks at play here!

Itís actually just a Chromatic descent from C. If you have a piano in the house you can play this relatively easily. Just play a C note 7 times, then the next note down 9 times, then the next 7 times and repeat this process a lot. You can do it on almost any instrument. Anyone can play this!

It is an illusion that is always descending. At c.37 seconds it pitches up an octave, so you donít run out of notes. Probably does that a few times throughout the tune. The advantage of having two low end monsters (bass instruments) is if they do this "reset" at different times then it maintains the constantly falling motif.

Math people will be able to work out that 7+9=16. So if you play a steady traditional 4 that sort of works too. WIth the Belew jangles and other guitar phrases, along with the two drummers being quite liberal with this combo of different counts (9,7,4) it creates the swirling descent we love.

If you study 90ís and 00ís Crimson there is a lot of this kind of polyrhythmic thing going on and at times the whole band is playing its own individual counts which if done well can be very exciting to listen to. Although it this kind of thing is not easy to play on certain tunes!

There are various accounts of the band even debating amongst themselves what is actually going on count wise within a given tune. For me the magic is the way they appear to be bending the fabric of time on occasion. I suppose its the advancement of work begun with Discipline, and allows quite simple material (e.g the chromatic run down of Marine) to appear to evolve and shift about in the course of the song.

Iím not lying!

Other music...etc
:: Posted by AndrewJohn on November 17, 2014

...have to agree with recent posts...Iíve just seen Kenny Wayne Shepherd Band and then, last Friday, Aynsley Lister. Blues of different flavours played by inspired and gifted bands displaying the significant connection between American and British styles. Grade A* baby!

Coming from a similar neighbourhood & northwest environment to NoelG, hats off to the man with his feet on the ground. It cost a tenner to see AL, but this belies the sheer quality of the experience. KWSBand were amazing.......and this is why live írock musicí can be so awe inspiring.

I remember well the excitement of seeing The LOG at M/cPoly Nov 22 1980 and seeing Johnny Too-Bad beat the most limited of drum kits with such precision and attitude. (BobbyF certainly knows how to pickíem.)

Finished my sojourn thru Starless a few days ago. Brilliant. Loved it.

My untutored assessment of feelings after hearing the trio of boxsets;

LTiA The Complete Recordings = Freedom & No Boundaries

Starless = Excitement & Enthusiasm

The Road to Red = Confident & Peerless

....it is all about the music.

....so its with a tinge of sadness, but a deal of joy that we move towards Advent and a special 2015.

Lenny Kravitz
:: Posted by fhc339835 on November 16, 2014

There is other music out there (one of the posters already mentioned this).
Lenny and his band were sensational yesterday evening in Munichís Olympiahalle. Lookout for the band with the very famous ladies on drums (Cindy Blackman-Santana) and bass (Gail Ann Dorsey), and the horns that blow all of the 21st century schizoid soul.
What a man, what a band.

Fracture footage?...and Fractured dreams
:: Posted by snkzato1 on November 16, 2014

Is there any video footage of Robert playing Fracture or someone doing a very solid cover? Iím very curious to see what its like to see being done. As a non-guitarist, hearing it tends to make my brain collapse under the sheer quantity of notes in such a short amount of time.

As a complete aside, The Elements Tour line-up must still be lingering in my sub-conscious as last night I had a dream that Robert (in full cowboy gear no less) and the three drummers were now doing double duty as Taylor Swiftís backing band. Apparently she had recorded a new song based on íHell-Hounds of Crimí...Strange to say the least.

Thoughts on a few threads
:: Posted by caseyjbye on November 16, 2014

Thought Iíd throw my two cents into some of these discussions.

The lying thing, I think, like many are saying, isnít about lying in oneís personal life or even using lies to heighten a reality in a more digestible package--using lies to clarify truth (like Wildeís amazing "The Decay of Lying" essay or through hyperbolic about your experiences like Tom Waits does to better serve the world created in his art). Lying, as an artist simply to make money, being untrue to oneself--selling out, in essence--would be the problem. For example, it makes very little sense to judge an artistís work based on their personal lives (where, for example, they could be liars about all sorts things, even criminal liars). It doesnít make me enjoy Chinatown any less to know the horrifying things Roman Polanski has done in his life. I wrote an article about this earlier this year when the whole Woody Allen controversy came up, if anyone is interested: http://www.praguerevue.com/ViewArticle?articleId=3987

As a matter of fact (shameless plug) I wrote a tongue in cheek article proclaiming my love of all things Crimson and Prog for the same journal. Some of my fellow Crim-heads here, especially if youíve ever tried to get a friend or girlfriend into Crimson and failed might actually get a kick out of it: http://www.praguerevue.com/ViewArticle?articleId=2140

On "Coda: Marine 475": Mathusela, Iíve always loved the way Crimson, in the truest sense of minimalism, can take a relatively simple theme and seemingly beat it into the ground yet somehow make it constantly changing for the ear. Iíve never seen charts of the song, but I think part of it has to do with the variations occurring over the descending bassline. So for example, when Frippís guitar begins ascending, it affects the way you hear the descending pattern thatís been repeating as if itís actually gotten lower.

It probably also has something to do with the range of both Tony and Treyís instruments that they may be augmenting the lowest bass note by additionally doubling the descending notes say 2 keys higher, then 1 key higher. Also, the way Belew keeps just thraking away on that jangly chord based on the root notes of the key is deceptive because some of the bass notes are outside of the standard Pentatonic scale most of our Western ears are used to.

So sometimes they feel like "grace" notes (as you might hear in jazz--a note thatís out of the standard key) sort of assisting the progression into the resolving note (basically, our ears are anticipating the next note). And as the bass progression does nothing but descend the scale (no notes alter to suddenly ascend in the bass, other than starting back at the top of the scale) you continue to anticipate the final resolution, but because those "grace" notes maintain and the progression just keeps repeating, you never really get it until the song ends (on what was the first note of the progression).

Thatís my guess at least.

Re: Bob Dylan -- P.S.
:: Posted by markmmarkm on November 15, 2014

I bet had RF known of the Dylan untruths, he would not have cited him in his shortlist.

Re: Bob Dylan
:: Posted by markmmarkm on November 15, 2014

"Do you think John Lennon lied for money? Dylan? Hendrix? When we lose faith in our artists, our culture is extinguished." --RF


Posted by timohara on November 15, 2014:

From my perspective, it doesnít matter if Bob Dylan has fabricated his entire life story in his memoirs and in interviews. I hear an essential truth in his music and words that exists apart from the person himself. I do not think he lied in his work.
This is exactly what I took RF to mean as well.

I took Fripp to mean that tho the named individuals might, say, lie to their sig other (e.g., "No your butt does not look fat in those jeans") or such, they would certainly not lie for money.

One of Dylanís works is Chronicles and I for one am glad I neither spent money to buy nor the time to read it for I WOULD FEEL RIPPED OFF IF I DID.

I used to be an avid fan of Dylanís until what -- for me -- was his first alienating action: getting preachy when newly a Christian (Slow Train Coming album).

I am not perfect (who is?) but integrity is very important to me and tho I freely acknowledge his great art, Dylan doesnít otherwise pass muster.

Isnít one of the, I assume, Fripp aphorisms at the bottom of these webpages something like "Success implies responsibility"?

Re: Coda Marine
:: Posted by DannyX on November 15, 2014

Itís the audio equivalent of one of those Escher staircases. ;)

What is the secret of Vroom's Coda Marine
:: Posted by matthusela on November 15, 2014

Can anyone explain what is going on with Vroomís Coda Marine that makes it feel as though the music is constantly stepping down? It canít really be, but it feels like the notes/chords are stepping down for minutes on end. Can someone explain?

Bob Dylan
:: Posted by timohara on November 15, 2014

From my perspective, it doesnít matter if Bob Dylan has fabricated his entire life story in his memoirs and in interviews. I hear an essential truth in his music and words that exists apart from the person himself. I do not think he lied in his work.
This is exactly what I took RF to mean as well.

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